Author Topic: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets  (Read 15884 times)

Alizel

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allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« on: June 11, 2013, 07:57:21 am »
hey guys im kind of a noob so bare with me.

i have 5 nics on my zentyal 1 wan, 4 lan. each are on a different subnet.

my lan's are
10.10.0.x/24
10.10.1.x/24
10.10.2.x/24
10.10.3.x/24

i would like to allow machines from x.x.1.x, x.x.2.x, and x.x.3.x to be able to see one another. via name.
i can ping via ip and view fileshares no problem via ip. but i would like the machines to "discover" one another mostly because lan games like saints row 3 wont allow you to connect directly via ip

thanks guys.

christian

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2013, 08:48:06 am »
The way you describe it, it looks like there is an issue resolving names from one subnet to another but you don't tell if you can resolve names for machine on same subnet.

You also don't tell is you are using DHCP or not and neither if you have enabled dynamic DNS.

If everything is static, I don't see any reason why it would not work, especially if you have one single domain (I mean DNS domain as "domain" word is often confusing even in this context)
If you have different domains, this should work to but may require to type FQDN as Zentyal allows only for one search domain if I remember well.

If you are using DHCP, ensure dynamic DNS is configured  ;) and then you're back to above point with search domain.

christian

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2013, 08:57:28 am »
Notice that your post should be moved somewhere in "server" section as it has, for what I understand, no link with desktop, does it?

Alizel

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2013, 05:59:06 am »
i suppose it should sorry.

also names per subnet resolve fine

my machine is on 10.10.1.x and can resolve my NAS and minecraft/terraria/wutever server as well as itself fine. other pc on other subnets can see one another too. (clciking on "network" in windows explorer)

each subnet broadcasts DHCP. the machines currently on my subnet are set static outside DHCP range. DHCP works fine on my subnet aswell as the others.

the other subnet PCs rely on DHCP, even lan-lan router acting as wireless gateway works via DHCP, phone receives an ip, can serf pr0n its on

i dont believe dynamic DNS is enabled. never touched it. should it be enabled?

somewhat of a side question and probably pretty nooberific too. but will local dns normaly not resolve unless there is a server/gateway to do it? like if i just have 2 pc's connected with a cat5 cable with static ip's?
;f learning is fun....

haha thanks for putting up with my shit.

christian

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2013, 06:46:36 am »
No aim to finger-point anything but I try to understand what's your landscape is made of  ;)

About dynamic DNS: the idea behind this is to automatically register in DNS machines getting IP address from DHCP server. Doing so, these machines can be found using FQDN. Potentially quite useful.

Something you do not describe however:
- are you using same domain for all subnet
- how do you try to reach servers ? using fqdn or only hostname ?

Alizel

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2013, 08:51:59 am »
hey no biggie,. and even if you were, it may be pointing in the right direction ;)

sorry im honestly not all that familiar with FQDN's so my zentyal server is just using a hostname. i called it zen

ah thats kind of what i thought DDNS does but any machine hosting anything to the web is static.

all the machines use only hostnames as work group PC's no domains

if by server you mean zentyal i can only reach it via IP.
my other "servers" are reached either by hostname or Ip. i may not have been clear, my MC server and my NAS are also on the 10.10.1.x/24 subnet, only machines across subnets are unreachable via hostname. they can be reached via ip.

christian

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2013, 08:59:23 am »
if you don't use "domain", then DNS (D standing for Domain in the Domain Names Server) is pretty useless isn't it  :P

Alizel

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2013, 07:23:41 am »
well i may use a class A address for my lan but don't be fooled. i'm by no means a network admin ;p by local DNS what i mean is Hostnames. seems i made a big error in accusing them of being a domain name.

christian

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2013, 07:39:30 am »
Frankly I never tried to maintain DNS zone without any domain name (BTW that's what you're currently trying to achieve if my understanding is correct).
I don't think it has anything to do with subnet mask.

What I mean to say is that IP addressing plan and naming are two different animals with no tight links.

Correct naming to be handled by DNS expects, for what I understand, hierarchical naming, meaning this can't be "host name" only.
Look at: try to create new "domain" in Zentyal: first step, at least in 2.2, is to create "domain name". I don't think this can be empty. So I wonder what you really have on your side.

What I suspect is that you do have valid (or existing) domain but are used to resolve names using only host name because system handle it on your behalf relying on the "search domain" feature that is perhaps empty in your current configuration.
Have a look at this in case it helps  8)

Rafael Muylaert

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2013, 08:41:34 pm »
In DHCP options for each local interface, under WINS server: select local zentyal. this way you can reach other machines by name across your router.

christian

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2013, 10:03:52 pm »
In DHCP options for each local interface, under WINS server: select local zentyal. this way you can reach other machines by name across your router.

As a workaround...  :-X

This works only if you are also running "file server" module because WINS emulation comes with Samba.
This is Netbios over TCP  ::)

So if you are in a "Windows only" world and have deployed WINS server (could be Zentyal with Samba) why not but this is however not the right way to proceed it you keep in mind that unix/linux  host should have domain name if any application or component uses DNS.

Alizel

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2013, 12:08:33 am »
alright. ill look at the docs again.

in the install i did give it a name. i do own a TLD but have done nothing with it sofar. so upon installing zentyal i named it like "hostname.domainname.tld"
i havn't linked it in anyway with my tld yet though.

however under general configuration, its hostname is zen and its domain is ed.shawcable.net
i can't seem to locate "search domain" is it a package?

having a local domain do i need to connect the pc's to the domain or can they still operate as "workgroup" computers?

WINS and Samba are still beyond my comprehension so ill stay away from that ;p

side question. can i access zentyal's terminal through the web interface? or do i have to ssh in?


thanks guys.

christian

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Re: allowing local DNS to resolve across subnets
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2013, 06:23:34 am »
Sorry for this long hereafter message, I'll try to explain some basic concepts so that you improve your understanding. I hope it will not make things even more confused.

Despite his name network domain doesn't mean that devices within this domain are connected.
Of course they will have at some time but what I mean to say is that domain concept does not depend on connection status: very very high level view, domain covers devices under same "zone", thus defined within same domain or sub-domain attached to TLD.

So for Zentyal, while reinstalling, ensure this domain is set.

For what concerns devices, either you are using DHCP or you manually manage each device:

- if using DHCP, you will define in DHCP
     => the search domain option (this assumes you have configured DNS service, do not mix this up with DNS settings in network section)
     => the domain device belongs to (in the dynamic DNS options)

- if not using DHCP, you will have to define these parameters at each device level

Quote
having a local domain do i need to connect the pc's to the domain or can they still operate as "workgroup" computers?

Network domain and workgroup or even to some extend Microsoft domain are different concepts. Long time ago, TCP/IP was not perceived as the default protocol for networking. Like Novell with Netware, Microsoft relied on its own implementation: NetBios and WINS instead of DNS. WINS is not hierarchical (reason why you reach devices using "short" name (BTW limited to 15 characters in fact 16 minus 1).
Samba still brings this WINS emulation and Netbios over TCP/IP has been invented to make things easier but also more confusing  ;D

Things have evolved as Microsoft is able now to fully rely on DNS for Windows domain (workgroup will not evolve  :-\) although is requires some rather specific DNS settings. and Netbios is no more a must  ::)

Answering to your side question: so far there is not terminal emulation via web server with Zentyal. You do have to SSH